Data: Wowhead's Forever database (mined from the game files), read 2026-10-25, corrected with in-game tooltips (Heightened Senses 4% at 2/2; Improved Gouge +0.5 s per rank). Wowhead sometimes shows the wrong rank: trust the in-game tooltip.
Click a talent to add a point, right-click (or Shift-click) to remove one. The Catalog and every talent panel follow the build selected here. Builds are saved in this browser.
Talents updated for the November 2, 2026 update. As WoW Forever changes, we update the calculator to match. Spot something that's off? Tell us in #site-corrections.
Talent positions in the tree are provisional until the official layout is confirmed.
Data: Wowhead's Forever database (mined from the game files), read 2026-10-25, corrected with in-game tooltips (Heightened Senses 4% at 2/2; Improved Gouge +0.5 s per rank). Wowhead sometimes shows the wrong rank: trust the in-game tooltip.
Mage data: Wowhead's Forever database (spell details and talent per-rank values), read 2026-10-26. "Confirm" = untested on Forever. Counters come from the mage matchup file.
Classic rules; Forever hasn't published its own yet. Players only, per target, per category. Effects in the same category diminish each other, whoever cast them.
| Category | Your abilities | Shares DR with |
|---|---|---|
| Stun | Cheap Shot | Hammer of Justice, Bash, Charge / Intercept stun, Pounce, Intimidation, War Stomp, Concussion Blow |
| Kidney Shot | Kidney Shot (own category in classic) | Nothing |
| Incapacitate | Gouge, Sap | Polymorph |
| Disorient | Blind | Scatter Shot |
| None | Garrote, Rupture, poisons, Crippling | – |
Applies before DR. Gouge, Sap and Blind aren't stuns, so they stay full length on Orcs.
| Stun | Normal | Orc | Orc, 2nd in DR |
|---|---|---|---|
| Cheap Shot | 4 s | 3.2 s | 1.6 s |
| Kidney Shot, 5 points | 6 s | 4.8 s | 2.4 s |
| Kidney Shot, 4 points | 5 s | 4 s | 2 s |
Is Kidney Shot still its own category? Do Gouge, Sap and Polymorph share one? How long is the window? Is there a PvP cap on crowd-control length (TBC had 10 s)?
A number that doesn't match the game, a tooltip that's out of date, an ability that works differently on Forever? Tell us in #site-corrections on the NineFingers Discord. Say which tab and ability, and add a screenshot of the in-game tooltip if you can. Corrections from players testing in game are how this site stays right.